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Kathryn Bigelow's "Zero Dark Thirty"

aaronaaron Posts: 20,945 mod
edited August 2012 in Movies
Her next feature film after the Best Picture-winning "The Hurt Locker", this is Bigelow's film about the manhunt for Bin Laden:

Post edited by aaron on
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Comments

  • Bigelow <3
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    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • I hated the hurt locker, so....

    Brilliant movie.
    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • RichardRichard Posts: 48,634 mod
    I got bored of it, the movie wasnt for me.
  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Henrick said:

    I hated the hurt locker, so....

    Brilliant movie.
    For you.

    It was a god awful portayal of the Iraq war with no character investment to make up for it.

    Oh yeah, and the entire movie is a bunch of American propaganda.
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  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Like, when he's soooooo bored of suburban life and wants back in the army, it's like, REALLY?! Is your life that terrible that you want to risk dying? How unrealistic, I didn't know we were in the 1800s again where going to war was something everyone wanted to do because it was a thrill. That's part one of the propaganda, "loll suburban life sucks, army is THRILL SEEKING BITCHESSS!"

    Then there's the unrealistic lead. No man like that would ever lead men. He puts himself in suicidal situations time and time again I just couldn't handle it because in real life, this man would never be in charge, hell, he wouldn't be allowed at all. There's such bad portrayals of what actually happened and soldier life.

    Finally, another piece of propaganda was the citizens. Do they make you feel bad for citizens that were openly shot and killed? LOL NOPE! After the cell phone scene, it makes every citizen seem like they're waiting to kill you. No mention of groups of people being killed like in the actual war, just making you feel bad for soldiers thinking "oh my god anyone here could be a terrorist, fuck all of them could!" Like seriously, that's obvious propaganda as I've ever seen.

    Too much poopiness to handle.
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  • Of course it is for ME. Would expect me to write: I'm my dearest and honest opinion I believe and also think that, FOR ME, this is a brilliant movie?

    LOL
    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • And if you took the movie's message as "war propaganda", I'm really sorry for you. You totally misunderstood it.
    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Henrick said:

    Of course it is for ME. Would expect me to write: I'm my dearest and honest opinion I believe and also think that, FOR ME, this is a brilliant movie?

    LOL

    I was just saying, loll, believe me, I hate it when people assume you're saying "oh this is fact." I didnt mean to imply you were asserting your opinion as fact.
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  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Like, when he's soooooo bored of suburban life and wants back in the army, it's like, REALLY?! Is your life that terrible that you want to risk dying? How unrealistic, I didn't know we were in the 1800s again where going to war was something everyone wanted to do because it was a thrill. That's part one of the propaganda, "loll suburban life sucks, army is THRILL SEEKING BITCHESSS!"

    Then there's the unrealistic lead. No man like that would ever lead men. He puts himself in suicidal situations time and time again I just couldn't handle it because in real life, this man would never be in charge, hell, he wouldn't be allowed at all. There's such bad portrayals of what actually happened and soldier life.

    Finally, another piece of propaganda was the citizens. Do they make you feel bad for citizens that were openly shot and killed? LOL NOPE! After the cell phone scene, it makes every citizen seem like they're waiting to kill you. No mention of groups of people being killed like in the actual war, just making you feel bad for soldiers thinking "oh my god anyone here could be a terrorist, fuck all of them could!" Like seriously, that's obvious propaganda as I've ever seen.

    Too much poopiness to handle.

    Looks like Bane was right, loll. People just seem to use the buttons instead of actually making a debate or discussing things.
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  • RyGuyRyGuy Posts: 7,802 mod
    Lost Cause. It's no use to debate on here any longer. People are too hyped up in their own opinions to be open to any others. Ive resorted to buttons instead of replies. I dont have time for well thought out replies anymore as Im a busy busy man that only gets to check this page once a night these days :3

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  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    RyGuy said:

    Lost Cause. It's no use to debate on here any longer. People are too hyped up in their own opinions to be open to any others.

    That part kinda hurts, seeing I try (at least I think I do) to be open.

    I wouldn't specifically ask for your opinions guys if I didn't want to know, lmfao. I'm asking because I want to know. People here have changed my opinion before, so I'm definitely open to anything you'd say.
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  • aaronaaron Posts: 20,945 mod

    I don't buy the "Bin Laden Raid" for a second. :-B

    ^This, kids, is called 4Chan syndrome.
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  • XDMorsmordreXDXDMorsmordreXD Posts: 6,730 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Conspiracy Theorists 8-|
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    Image and video hosting by TinyPic
    Mysterious thing time.
  • chip_985chip_985 Posts: 54

    Like, when he's soooooo bored of suburban life and wants back in the army, it's like, REALLY?! Is your life that terrible that you want to risk dying? How unrealistic, I didn't know we were in the 1800s again where going to war was something everyone wanted to do because it was a thrill. That's part one of the propaganda, "loll suburban life sucks, army is THRILL SEEKING BITCHESSS!"

    Then there's the unrealistic lead. No man like that would ever lead men. He puts himself in suicidal situations time and time again I just couldn't handle it because in real life, this man would never be in charge, hell, he wouldn't be allowed at all. There's such bad portrayals of what actually happened and soldier life.

    Finally, another piece of propaganda was the citizens. Do they make you feel bad for citizens that were openly shot and killed? LOL NOPE! After the cell phone scene, it makes every citizen seem like they're waiting to kill you. No mention of groups of people being killed like in the actual war, just making you feel bad for soldiers thinking "oh my god anyone here could be a terrorist, fuck all of them could!" Like seriously, that's obvious propaganda as I've ever seen.

    Too much poopiness to handle.

    I think that was the central thrust of the film, Rowling: to show the disconnect some soldiers feel when they return from combat. I'm not a soldier but from what I read and hear in interviews, a lot of soldiers seem to lose hold of the ability to live in the civilian world after extended tours of duty. Adjusting to that kind of life - being physically and mentally ON all the time because your death could literally come form anywhere at any moment? It takes a toll, and I think that's what The Hurt Locker was showing - an extreme case, certainly, but most narratives need to show extreme cases to make their point. Here was a man who'd compeltely lost the ability to live a normal life as most would define it: his home was combat. In that respect, THL could be read as a tragedy. And I don't agree that they show no sympathy for the citizens - what about the man Jeremy Renner tries frantically to save and can't? The desperation of Renner's performance, the ratcheting tension, the fear in that poor Iraqi's face? I'll tell you, I sure felt for him. And the suspicion with which the soldiers treated Iraqis in the film was only realism - it's a guerilla war; the people they're fighting dress in civvies. Anyone could be out to kill them. I think THL hit such a nerve because it was a war movie that managed to leave politics completely out - it was a character tale, the tragedy of a man addicted to combat.

    That said, such a character is hard to relate to, so I understand how you couldn't sympathise. I didn't love it, but I certainly appreciate the artistic and technical skill it took to pull that movie off.
  • yonythemoonyyonythemoony Posts: 5,478 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Desplat is scoring the movie. I knew that after Guardians he had to do something in the last months of 2012.
  • Lord_DarkeyesLord_Darkeyes Posts: 4,905 ✭✭✭✭
    I was never a huge fan of the hurt locker, but I'll give this one a try.
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  • yonythemoonyyonythemoony Posts: 5,478 ✭✭✭✭✭
    After listening the score for Argo, can't wait to hear how Desplat will deal with this one.
  • darthorcruxdarthorcrux Posts: 584 ✭✭✭✭
    I'll listen to the score but after The Hurt Locker I wouldn't watch this movie to feed a starving child.
  • NumberEightNumberEight Posts: 1,574 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Richard said:

    It doesnt look that good.

    Of course not. The most offensive thing is that it's going to capitalize on tens of thousands of deaths.
    Pottermore username: DustBlade76

    So Crucify the ego, before it's far too late, to leave behind this place so negative and blind and cynical. And you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable.
  • RyGuyRyGuy Posts: 7,802 mod

    Richard said:

    It doesnt look that good.

    Of course not. The most offensive thing is that it's going to capitalize on tens of thousands of deaths.
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    Welcome to America's Entertainment Industry where some dead people can make lots and lots of money! Its a joke, really.

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  • yonythemoonyyonythemoony Posts: 5,478 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 2012
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    Now we know who'll be the real star of the movie.

    Also, for people complaing:

    Bigelow and Boal had initially worked on and finished a movie script centered around the 2001 siege in Tora Bora, where bin Laden was once believed to be hiding. The two were about to begin filming when news broke that bin Laden had been killed. They immediately shelved the film they had been working on and redirected their focus, essentially starting from scratch.
    So Bigelow is not capitalizing on 9/11 for this film. And some comments mention that Bigelow had access to reports, to try to make the film realistic.
    Post edited by yonythemoony on
  • NumberEightNumberEight Posts: 1,574 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I am talking about the dead civilians in Afghanistan and Iraq, yonythemoony.
    Pottermore username: DustBlade76

    So Crucify the ego, before it's far too late, to leave behind this place so negative and blind and cynical. And you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable.
  • Movie has been receiving raves, and Chastain being pointed as having the best performance of the year.
    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • NumberEightNumberEight Posts: 1,574 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The trailer gives me a Homeland vibe, so I'll see it.
    Pottermore username: DustBlade76

    So Crucify the ego, before it's far too late, to leave behind this place so negative and blind and cynical. And you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable.
  • RyGuyRyGuy Posts: 7,802 mod
    I sincerely hope this movie plays more at truth than propaganda. I'm going to definitely check it out but I hope my fears are not realized.

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  • aaronaaron Posts: 20,945 mod
    RyGuy said:

    I sincerely hope this movie plays more at truth than propaganda. I'm going to definitely check it out but I hope my fears are not realized.

    From what I've heard, Bigelow and the cast got exclusive information from the Obama Administration to help make the film more realistic. But then again, it is also a mainstream film, and they're not going to divulge even most of what happened. Obviously it's going to be dramatized just like, say, The Social Network. It's a bad comparison, but imho I'm not going in to the film hoping that they'll tell a truthful story. I know prior that it will be a loosely-based story. I'm going to go in hoping that the film is spectacular (which, based off the clip with Jessica Chastain, it looks like it.) I hope there's not subtle propaganda though. It just gets in the way of the film-watching experience.
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  • I doubt there is any propaganda in the movie. Bigelow is a very careful director in those terms and already prove it with The Hurt Locker. :)
    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • Darth LedgerDarth Ledger Posts: 6,530 ✭✭✭✭✭
    The reviews are pretty damn good so far... War movies are among my least favorite though. I hate war.
    "If you make yourself more than just a man... If you devote yourself to an ideal... You become something else entirely- A Legend."

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  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Henrick said:

    I doubt there is any propaganda in the movie. Bigelow is a very careful director in those terms and already prove it with The Hurt Locker. :)

    It's a war film, there's going to be propaganda. The Hurt Locker had its fair share.

    Hurt Locker just seems to skim over the millions of innocent lives lost in Iraq and focuses on the "American heroes who died to defend their country and help make Iraq a safer place." Lol no, how about a million dead and many million refugees. How does the film look when it completely ignores those topics? What stance is it taking by knowing full well these are subjects of importance and skimming over them? Is the film saying "well we don't care about the civilian deaths or the completely unjustified and unconstitutional war"? Is there anything about these conflicts? It's more about the emotional response from American soldiers. That's fine, there's nothing wrong with that, but how about not skipping over important matters such as those! By skipping over them, it takes a stance as a pro-war film.

    The butcher scene makes the viewer feel for the Americans. It puts you in their mind thinking: "anyone here might kill me" as opposed to "let's find the bad guy and not kill civilians."

    The film is supposed to be anti-war, I mean, war is a drug right? Then why does the main character thrive for it? Why do the scenes fill you with excitement and adrenaline rather than horror and grief? He isn't scarred by the war, he's missing it! If that's not a pro-war part of the film I don't know what is. It's the usual "Americans are here for good reason to save lives kick butt and action packed adrenaline." Yeah, no.

    I'm not accusing Bigelow of purposely going "gee, I want to make a pro-war film!" Of course not, she's a good director. I'm accusing her of leaving out major components of the war that result in her film looking like a pro-war propaganda film.

    And let's not forget numerous servicemen talk about the sheer unrealistic events of the movie.

    Now I'm probably being biased - I am Iraqi and my family has been personal affected by this war to terrible degrees - so when I see a film like this that emphasizes the American war-action story and forgets the true horror and terrible facts behind the war many Americans ignore or do not know, well, it just pisses me the fuck off.
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  • yonythemoonyyonythemoony Posts: 5,478 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2012
    From Jessica Chastain's facebook:
    There seems to be a lot of confusion as to the motives of ZD30. I'm not interested in being in a film that pushes a political agenda. This is a movie that asks questions of the audience. The filmmakers aren't interested in answering those question. We must leave the theatre and begin a conversation about our American history. We must ask, where have we been? And where do we intend to go from here? xxjes

    “There’s definitely a degree to which I wish the torture and interrogation techniques weren’t a part of this narrative, but they were a part of history. It was part of the research, and had I not included it I would not be telling the full story of this manhunt.” -Kathryn Bigelow
    Post edited by yonythemoony on
  • NumberEightNumberEight Posts: 1,574 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Martin, I just returned from seeing it. There is no propaganda, but what you also fear is true: the appalling activities by the hands of America are vaguely mentioned but have no meaningful commentary. The film is completely mediocre and worth only seeing once. If you can see it legitimately without having to pay so you can ease your conscience, I'd recommend it.
    Pottermore username: DustBlade76

    So Crucify the ego, before it's far too late, to leave behind this place so negative and blind and cynical. And you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable.
  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Martin, I just returned from seeing it. There is no propaganda, but what you also fear is true: the appalling activities by the hands of America are vaguely mentioned but have no meaningful commentary. The film is completely mediocre and worth only seeing once. If you can see it legitimately without having to pay so you can ease your conscience, I'd recommend it.

    I'll wait for it to come to redbox/netflix then
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  • Martin1Martin1 Posts: 7,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Is the film more so about hunting Osama or the on going war? If its more about hunting Osama ill probably be able to forgive those facts a bit.
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  • NumberEightNumberEight Posts: 1,574 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Bin laden. But they are interconnected, those two things. It's impossible to have any intellectual discussion on Bin Laden without mentioning the attempts to tie Al Qaeda to Iraq and the chaos that resulted from that.
    Pottermore username: DustBlade76

    So Crucify the ego, before it's far too late, to leave behind this place so negative and blind and cynical. And you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable.
  • Wow. You totally misunderstood all the concept and message behind the movie. I don't have time to write a paragraph now, I will later... but how can a movie that starts with the quote "War is a Drug" be a propaganda of war? For me, the movie it's exactly the opposite and you should rewatch because you didn't read between the lines.
    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • NumberEightNumberEight Posts: 1,574 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Henrick said:

    Wow. You totally misunderstood all the concept and message behind the movie. I don't have time to write a paragraph now, I will later... but how can a movie that starts with the quote "War is a Drug" be a propaganda of war? For me, the movie it's exactly the opposite and you should rewatch because you didn't read between the lines.

    I really want to see The Hurt Locker fully. What Martin described appeared to me to be the side effects of being addicted to war, not pro-war propaganda
    Pottermore username: DustBlade76

    So Crucify the ego, before it's far too late, to leave behind this place so negative and blind and cynical. And you will come to find that we are all one mind, capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable.
  • Here we go what? This is a forum where we are supposed to discuss stuff. If you don't want to be part of the discussion, just ignore the thread and posts. No need for mocking and posting unnecessary gifs.
    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited January 2013
    Richard said:

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    Oh so you also can control the number of flags? 5 troll? Really? Just because I'm making an insight about a movie? Grow up Richard, honestly. You're being an asshole now. And why am I'm trolling if I'm posting an opinion about a movie? This behavior is totally unnacepted for a Forum moderator.
    Post edited by [Deleted User] on
    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • Henrick said:

    Wow. You totally misunderstood all the concept and message behind the movie. I don't have time to write a paragraph now, I will later... but how can a movie that starts with the quote "War is a Drug" be a propaganda of war? For me, the movie it's exactly the opposite and you should rewatch because you didn't read between the lines.

    I really want to see The Hurt Locker fully. What Martin described appeared to me to be the side effects of being addicted to war, not pro-war propaganda
    Exactly, man. The final 10 minutes of the movie totally illustrates how war is disgusting and what they do to soldiers heads.

    image image image
    We'll never be forgiven for what we did.
    Trust me, I'm a Film Grad ;)
  • RichardRichard Posts: 48,634 mod
    edited January 2013
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